Re: Letters of Reccomendation -Reply

[typapay@Rollins.Edu]

Stephen, thanks for the clarification!  I too would like to shift the
concept of assessment.  On the other hand, I never really feel compelled
to write letters.  I guess I like having the choice and being able to note
the really good work many of our peer writing consultants do.  I just
talked a peer consultant out of wanting a reference from me--I'd fired him
for not showing up pretty regularly.  When I said I's have to write the
circumstances under which he left, he asked, "What were they?"  This is
not the student I'd write for.   He still wanted to give Forbes Magazine
my name for a phone call to verify employment, and I could only repeat
that this would put him in the position of explaining how he'd changed in
terms of commitment to the job!

Mostly I'd like to find better ways of determining who should be hired or
admitted.  But I doubt if our proposals would reach far by themselves.  We
probably need partnerships with the corporate and industrial world if we
want to have a voice in how this is done.  Maybe a better place to start
would be our own institutions.  If we demonstrate that we can develop
better means of assessment than those we don't really believe in, we might
be taken more seriously in making changes elsewhere.

Where do people get their notions that everything has to be measured and
analyzed in certain very particular ways?  From teachers--at least
starting at about age 5 and continuing through the "terminal" degree--that
is, if one survived it despite the term.

twila
typapay@rollins.edu 

On Tue, 4 Feb 1997, Stephen Newmann wrote:

> Twyla, I didn't mean to suggest that we should not write these letters for
> our students--only that we should not *have* to write them.  I'm
> suggesting that others are putting their own responsibilities of assessing
> students preparedness for whatever it is students want to do onto
> educators.  I'm suggesting that educators should have only to offer
> education and should be able to let others worry about determining how
> much of that education has "taken".  Same goes for grad school as for the
> workplace in my mind.  If we were to stop credentialing folks many would
> lose interest in education and especially in graduate education.  I doubt
> graduate schools would be overrun by students and those who could not cut
> it (ie, could not learn what was being offered) would just go elsewhere
> and do other things.  --stephen
> 
> On Tue, 4 Feb 1997 typapay@rollins.edu wrote:
> 
> > Stephen, I understand the point you make about our perhaps not being the
> > best people to assess our students' preparation for the corporate world.
> > I wonder if you would make the same argument regarding graduate school
> > letters?  If we can't write any letters, who will be doing such assessing?
> > 
> > I have another concern as well.  Whatever our own politics, in my area
> > students cannot be considered for most jobs available to them without
> > letters of reference from faculty.  (Of course, they also use Writing
> > Center directors for employer letters, as we do employ them to do a job--
> > and presumably assess their work periodically.)
> > 
> > Do we have the right to take our students' money for four years (I know, I
> > know, we give good value--the best in the market--for it), then refuse to
> > give them something they need to make use of their educations for
> > earning a livlihood?  I realize, of course, that the great value of what
> > we all teach goes far beyond the market and paychecks.  But I do want my
> > students to survive financially in order to do all the meaningful value-
> > building work their educations have introduced them to!
> > 
> > Just wondering.
> > 
> > Twila Yates Papay
> > Rollins College
> > Winter Park, FL
> > typapay@rollins.edu
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
>